As commonly seen in the IT world, we get a new gadget or program or API and play with all it's cool features and tricks. Though we've been through this process countless times before, the first time we run into a problem or are unable to achieve a desired task, aversion sets in! We're amazed and baffled that this new item can't help us take over the world....the nerve! lol Perhaps, I too am guilty of just expecting too much all of the time :-( In an effort to provide constructive self-criticism as well, I'll note this area as an opportunity for improvement in my personal growth!
So, Lucia from Pandora, whom is extremely knowledgeable and responsive, provided feedback a few weeks ago to help refine my created playlist. I started last night around 11:48pm (sidebar--based on my previous blogs, it's safe to say that I am somewhat a NIGHT OWL, I don't know when that started or how I've managed to keep it up, maybe it was the nap I took after work)...so anyways, i started around 11:48pm and my mood was both upbeat and energetic. I chose my Kanye West playlist thinking the list previously created would suit my current listening needs. The first track played was Kanye West - Everything I Am. I actually love this track so I provided a thumbs up. Then, attempting to use some of the feedback previously received, I used the "guide us" option to input a song name, still by Kanye West but a track called Good Life which is slightly more upbeat. Of the next nine songs I listened to, 2 were excellent selections but the others.....not so much. Three were songs I used to like but I've heard them so much that they've fallen into the "overplayed" category. One was an intro track and again while I don't mind hearing some of the them during entire album play, I have mixed feelings about here intro/outro/prelude/interlude tracks in this setting. While I understand there are legal constraints that prevent the exact song entered from being played on demand, I was at least hoping to hear something extremely similar to the song I entered. That didn't happen. So I though to myself, maybe I've confused the system. I previously started this Kanye West station and have already tailored/created a certain listening preference. Maybe it was a bad idea to try and use the "guide us" option, after being so far into the station tailoring process. So...I decided to create a new station, using an initial input of the Good Life song, sometimes fresh starts are good for everyone! So at 12:09am, Im still upbeat and energetic and created this new playlist. The first two songs I either like somewhat or used to like but it's been overplayed so recognizing the thumbs down limitation (more on that later), i decided to let them play out. The next two songs offered were not to my liking at all, maybe b/c I didnt rate the first two songs the system thought they were wrongfully acceptable. Of the next 7 songs, only 2 met my needs at the moment :-( I still didn't hear the Good Life song that I initially selected or anything similar to the mood I was trying to create by selecting that song. Thinking that I've officially screwed up everything I worked so hard to achieve by submitting so many changes/requests, I decided to go back to my Kanye West station and try to revive it. I listened to a couple of songs then attempting to "undo" what I've done, I use the "guide us" option to change it back to artist Kanye West opposed to a particular song. I went through 37 songs during this period, only 13 of those were dead-on so the success percentage I've seen in the past is steadily declining. This knowledge engineering process isn't just rough on the developers, it impacts us users too!! (sidebar 2--this is actually a really good exercise as it allows me to see and understand the complexities and hardships on both ends of the spectrum: the developer and the user). I do want to add that of the 13 songs that were played, two of them are songs that I absolutely love and haven't heard in a while so I was like a kid in a candy store when I heard them and there was another track that I've never heard but plan on looking for the album because I liked the song so much...so there still are absolute and obvious benefits to Pandora though my session was sinking. So again while there were some really good recommendations during that period, when it got bad....it got really, really bad! 16 songs were tracks that I've never heard before and they were certainly not what I wanted to hear last night. I was offered a track by AC/DC called Moneytalks Live and I seriously question why?! I decided to investigate why I was hearing that song and the system says it was the hard rock roots, subtle use of vocal harmony, repetitive melodic phrasing, extensive vamping and a vocal-centric aesthetic. The previous track was Rhymefest Build Me Up...and I question how close the previously rated tracks exhibiti the features given for the explanation. Three songs later I was offered a song by The Eagles called New Kid in Town-----speechless :-( Again, I investigated why I was hearing this particular song and it was suggested for its country influences, mellow rock instrumentation, heavy use of vocal harmonies, intricate melodic phrasing and mixed acoustic and electric instrumentation. I don't claim to be the most eclectic individual and while I like to think I'm diverse, there are some genres that just don't do it for me, country is one of them!! The mere indication that the song had country influences, should have been enough to remove this song from recommendation -- this is me falling into the previously mentioned trap/pitfall. I expect this engine to know exactly what I went, when I want it and simultaenously gather those items that should never be offered to me -- perfect case of me trying to "take over the world"! lol About a quarter through the 37 songs I noticed my mood was gradually changing, growing more tired and restless by the song....but I wasn't finished working so I figured I would give a little more input to the system. At 2:45am i switched to OLD FAITHFUL! lol My John Legend playlist, noting my mood as "winding down". I listened to another 14 songs and of those 11 of those were ALL KINDS OF AWESOME!!!!! Two of those, I actually liked somewhat though they didnt get placed in my "awesome bucket"! So with that said, only 1 of the track played did I give a thumbs down!! YAY PANDORA!!! I can conceded that maybe I was attempting to do just a little too much in my other station and attempting to "right the wrong" is an even more daunting task!
Lastly, I would like to add the thumbs down limitation is a bit of a pest at times. Lucia, if you're listening, can you offer any insight as to why the limitation exist? During that rough spell I found myself doing other things around the house or lowering the volume since I had reached my thumbs down limitation for the time being. I even hit mute one time and apparently Pandora is smart enough to pick up on that...ooops! lol One of the biggest downfalls that Ive noticed by this limitation, other than me wanting to change the song immediately and not having the ability to do so, it seems as if it steers the recommendation engine in the wrong direction. If I could tell the system that I truly don't like that song, without worrying about the constraint, perhaps the system would be able to perform better analysis and queue songs that are more to my liking...just my thoughts though!
I think that's enough for now!!
Signing off!
Remi A
Hoping for better sessions in the future....
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Hi there Remi -
Here's some thoughts based on your latest test session:
I'm not sure if you know, but you can edit your station feedback at any time. If a station goes awry after recent feedback, just click on the triangle next to the station name (in your left-hand station menu), and select "edit this station."
From there you can check out the artists/songs you've added to the station as seeds and review the songs you marked as thumbs up and down. Putting a check mark in the box next to one of these, and then clicking on "remove checked" will set the feedback for it back to neutral.
You can thumbs down as many songs as you want, it's just that our licenses (regulated federally) only allow listeners to skip 6 songs per station per hour. So your thumbs down will register, you just won't be able to skip immediately to the next song.
But keep in mind: this limit is station-specific. So if there's a song playing that you don't like and you've run out of skips on that station, feel free to switch stations for awhile. (or create a new station...)
If you're tired of a song, but don't want to give it a thumbs down, just click on "Guide Us" and put the song "to sleep" for a month. That way your station definition isn't affected, but the song won't be so overplayed for you.
I can't tell you what exactly was going on with your station, but I can see that your station that's seeded with Kanye West and "Good Life" has lots of thumbs ups on it.
And generally speaking, the more thumbs ups a station has, the more it reaches out into other styles of music, based on all the musical traits of each song thumbed up.
Thumbs downs are really the best way to tailor a station, in terms of cutting out things you don't want. Thumbs ups certainly help, but they can sometimes make the station more broad than you intended.
It's true, Pandora will never know you personally or know what mood you're in, so it's impossible for it to ever dial in to exactly what you want to hear at any given moment. But I hope with some practice and some trial and error, your stations work out for you and you discover some great music!
- Lucia
(Pandora)
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